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#1 2019-11-11 23:42:24

Ben Kerin
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AEW could be done with extreme violence

Wrestling Observer Live, Bryan Alvarez:

“My impression after talking to people today is I don’t think you’re gonna see a match like this again for a long time if ever, okay?

I could be wrong, but the impression I was given is that Jon Moxley really wanted to do a match like this so they let him do the match. I think it’s out of his — I shouldn’t say it’s out of his system — but, it’s done now. I think it’s over.”

I think these matches are best saved for very special occasions.

Moxley needed this and to be frank, AEW is not going to become the next ECW or CZW. Network television would not allow the level of violence they displayed on PPV, and you're probably not going to draw in casuals if you market yourself as an extreme wrestling promotion in 2019.

That said, it was different and fun - but the right caliber of talent need to be involved in such matches, they come with very high risk to the wrestlers and brand reputation.

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#2 2019-11-12 01:31:24

IronFistMaiden
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Re: AEW could be done with extreme violence

Hot take. While I don't think AEW will become the next hardcore revolution I doubt these matches are off the table going forward. It's a TV-14 product. The network being against it seems unlikely. I think Alvarez has been too drowned by the current landscape of wrestling to really clearly think that one out. Things changed the moment AEW landed a major network deal and managed to get TV-14 rolling. It's specifically targeting a demographic that disappeared from the scene. They'd be wise to move forward with variety instead of converting to a more sanitized product. Tony has no incentive to only cater to what's currently here now or a negative segment of the audience and as stated, he's not. He wants people to watch pro wrestling *again*. He wants that core audience that left the scene which is about half of what's here now, with it went fan enthusiasm.

The major divide we have in this current wrestling scene is only just the beginning I think. Wrestling shouldn't be sans violence, blood, language and in your face attitude. This is concept is a byproduct of years of beating people over the head with garbage and when TNA dips their toe in violent waters, nobody is watching unfortunately as they may very well have burned their chances with a wider audience no matter what's to come or what it is currently. AEW quite openly put the sign up that this product is not specifically being developed FOR kids, and IS targeting what left the scene after WWE's massive drain on the industry the past 10+ years. The people in the audience with their faces in horror at the sight of blood and violence can go, but it's probably the most emotion they've felt at an event since they were 10 years old when Edge nailed John Cena with the belt that time.

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#3 2019-11-12 06:51:25

tvr34448
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Re: AEW could be done with extreme violence

Yeah it should be saved for special occasions, But fuck it was awesome!


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#4 2019-11-12 08:18:50

Majin Tween
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Re: AEW could be done with extreme violence

It should definitely be saved for special occasions.

...Like every Wednesday.

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#5 2019-11-12 09:56:57

RyanP
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Registered: 2019-11-06
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Re: AEW could be done with extreme violence

IronFistMaiden wrote:

Hot take. While I don't think AEW will become the next hardcore revolution I doubt these matches are off the table going forward. It's a TV-14 product. The network being against it seems unlikely. I think Alvarez has been too drowned by the current landscape of wrestling to really clearly think that one out. Things changed the moment AEW landed a major network deal and managed to get TV-14 rolling. It's specifically targeting a demographic that disappeared from the scene. They'd be wise to move forward with variety instead of converting to a more sanitized product. Tony has no incentive to only cater to what's currently here now or a negative segment of the audience and as stated, he's not. He wants people to watch pro wrestling *again*. He wants that core audience that left the scene which is about half of what's here now, with it went fan enthusiasm.

The major divide we have in this current wrestling scene is only just the beginning I think. Wrestling shouldn't be sans violence, blood, language and in your face attitude. This is concept is a byproduct of years of beating people over the head with garbage and when TNA dips their toe in violent waters, nobody is watching unfortunately as they may very well have burned their chances with a wider audience no matter what's to come or what it is currently. AEW quite openly put the sign up that this product is not specifically being developed FOR kids, and IS targeting what left the scene after WWE's massive drain on the industry the past 10+ years. The people in the audience with their faces in horror at the sight of blood and violence can go, but it's probably the most emotion they've felt at an event since they were 10 years old when Edge nailed John Cena with the belt that time.

  https://imgur.com/s9GgM6M

You can't win over everybody, but you can win.

If anyone is going to have a problem with the violence it would be the network. Even with a TV-14 rating there are still lines that TNT won’t let them cross and if I remember correctly there was an article that stated that(maybe not on this site) but I’m pretty sure that I saw in an article that TNT has already given them a line not to cross when it comes to their tv show. That said I think saving the extreme violence for their PPVs seems to make the most logical sense in my opinion.

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#6 2019-11-12 11:28:27

IronFistMaiden
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Re: AEW could be done with extreme violence

RyanP wrote:

If anyone is going to have a problem with the violence it would be the network. Even with a TV-14 rating there are still lines that TNT won’t let them cross and if I remember correctly there was an article that stated that(maybe not on this site) but I’m pretty sure that I saw in an article that TNT has already given them a line not to cross when it comes to their tv show. That said I think saving the extreme violence for their PPVs seems to make the most logical sense in my opinion.

Guess you'll find out when they show previews of the PPV. Not that I mind a reservation on the matches for PPV. Like I said, it's not gonna be the next hardcore revolution. There is really no good way to DO that anymore, but what Mox and Omega gave us was a good visual. The props used elicited both expected reactions. After the match those guys could wash off, get that shit off of them, most of the cuts already sealed. Cody certainly got the brunt of the unintentional damage. People overreacted, which is fine, I mean, there they are, talking about the horrors and others who were pretty thrilled to see some balls back in wrestling. Overall, it was exactly the right thing to do. Neither competitor got seriously injured, cuts were minor and nothing but expected bruising likely you'd get from any match if you dived and jumped off shit on to people but a hell of a visual. This is no different when people shit their pants over the "unprotected" Cody chair shot, turns out it was, great visual, even I bought it. I didn't see the gimmick behind it when it happened. I thought "oh damn he got wrecked", and it turns out it was done right after all. *shrug* Alvarez is certainly on the speculation trail... if he doesn't like it, who cares?


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#7 2019-11-12 15:01:17

Ahole
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Registered: 2019-11-04
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Re: AEW could be done with extreme violence

Ben Kerin wrote:

Wrestling Observer Live, Bryan Alvarez:

“My impression after talking to people today is I don’t think you’re gonna see a match like this again for a long time if ever, okay?

I could be wrong, but the impression I was given is that Jon Moxley really wanted to do a match like this so they let him do the match. I think it’s out of his — I shouldn’t say it’s out of his system — but, it’s done now. I think it’s over.”

I think these matches are best saved for very special occasions.

Moxley needed this and to be frank, AEW is not going to become the next ECW or CZW. Network television would not allow the level of violence they displayed on PPV, and you're probably not going to draw in casuals if you market yourself as an extreme wrestling promotion in 2019.

That said, it was different and fun - but the right caliber of talent need to be involved in such matches, they come with very high risk to the wrestlers and brand reputation.

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if they save this kinda thing for special occasions ...ill save my money for the same special occasions ...RED=GREEN


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#8 2019-11-12 18:53:01

WNSDaniel
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Re: AEW could be done with extreme violence

I saw a post that said something along the lines of, "Imagine if Moxley had gotten to perform a match like this in front of 100,000 fans" referring to his match with Lesnar at WM32. I think that's exactly what he would have liked. He wouldn't have cared if he lost the match, he just wanted to have a spotlight to go out there and entertain. Lesnar, unfortunately, had other ideas. Not saying Lesnar should have been up for bleeding, etc., but he should have been willing to toss Moxley/Ambrose around a bit more and portray his character as "The Beast Incarnate"

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#9 2019-11-13 04:33:58

Jayke1981
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Posts: 162

Re: AEW could be done with extreme violence

WNSDaniel wrote:

I saw a post that said something along the lines of, "Imagine if Moxley had gotten to perform a match like this in front of 100,000 fans" referring to his match with Lesnar at WM32. I think that's exactly what he would have liked. He wouldn't have cared if he lost the match, he just wanted to have a spotlight to go out there and entertain. Lesnar, unfortunately, had other ideas. Not saying Lesnar should have been up for bleeding, etc., but he should have been willing to toss Moxley/Ambrose around a bit more and portray his character as "The Beast Incarnate"

If anything, I think Brock would've been the PERFECT foil for Ambrose if the Moxley side of him was allowed to come out. Thing is, Sponsorships have sanitized WWE. I wish WWE could return to that era. Full Gear proved that there is an audience for it. We don't want it every week - but the OPTION of it possibly happening can't be a bad thing, surely?


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#10 2019-11-13 16:32:06

IronFistMaiden
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Re: AEW could be done with extreme violence

Jayke1981 wrote:

Full Gear proved that there is an audience for it. We don't want it every week - but the OPTION of it possibly happening can't be a bad thing, surely?

Pretty much. You're not gonna acquire a new and old audience by doing what the formula has been. We already seen and know that road and it's an old one, older and longer road than the Monday Night Wars, Attitude Era, Ruthless Aggression linearly combined. Longer than the entire history of ECW ('92-'01). There's no need to please everybody. During no period of wrestling did that occur so nobody should be trying to blaze that trail, it's impossible. If you need wrestling to lack violence, watch soaps... and shit, I'll take it every week. The spots they did weren't even that horrible. Some scrapes shouldn't be upsetting people given the genre we're sitting in. AEW is using visuals pretty well, cuz it's working, and I dunno what everybody else watched during Omega and Mox but it was just that, visually appealing w/ minimal damage you'd see without the objects used. It's not like dropping people on tables and diving out of rings is like landing on a mattress, it's probably more like landing on a LEGO piece. TV shows murder and kill all the time, what's different here? Stuntmen aren't the characters acting out the play of violence? I don't see anybody getting on a soap box for them, nor should they. We have this false equivalency since the Benoit situation and it's carried on and basically ruined the scene to the point where we treat these men like babies, like it's actual malice performed on each of the participants. The audience has become the opposite of an ECW crowd, which over time became desensitized to the action, now they're basically running around like they need a bib and diaper. If AEW can offer variety, it's leagues ahead of WWE. I don't have a problem with the level Mox/Omega did being special occasions, but damned if the product shouldn't be outwardly violent.. it's goddamn wrestling.


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